Kevin, it’s odd that you should first speak up after we ‘finalize’
this submission.  The draft version which was circulated weeks ago
is essentially the same, with minor changes, I think.

My response is basically, “Read what we wrote.”  Stop projecting
your issues onto this, w/o checking to see what is going on.
We gave testimony from 14 individuals, some of whom personally
write using ‘New Age’ terms.  I fully support their right to 
think the way they think — as I do your right to think the way
you think.  To suppose testimony with all its diversity of style
as being the core position of ‘social accountability’ is a 
mistake, however.  Please back off on that one.

|It appears that you 
|want to practice psychology so clients will “behave 
|approproriately,” according to your standards.

It is a given that the expectation to ‘behave
aproppriately’ or however you wish to spell it is
anathema to the clients.  What we are challenging is
the behavior modification ideology that expects us
to do so.

|This method of social accountability is akin to the  
|method employed by psychiatry and social work to 
|impose a rigid regimen of social control. You do say, 
|say what you mean, hence I shall. The first social 
|accountability client cop who comes near me telling 
|me I am not behaving socially accountably will get 
|my size 11 up his/her butt. 

There is no ‘regimen’ of social accountability such as you
invent, and I hope nobody tries to impose the sort of
social control that you envision here.  The problem is
that most/all of us live with that ‘method employed by
psychiatry and social work’ and commonly people find this
to be a great burden.  The difference is that we are
advocating for helping one another with this.  We are
asking for networking around individual discipline, a
positive act of resistance, where you are imagining
a whole cult-like behavioral standard ‘being imposed’.
Where I think our confusion is, is that we have somewhat
different angles for challenging cult-like behavioral
standards.

|Why not advocate for social accountability of the 
|parties doing the treatment? That makes a heck 
|of a lot more sense than picking on clients. Because 
|that is what you are doing when you practice SA.

You are certainly fond of insults.  The question we
asked was HOW do you advocate for ‘social accountability
of the parties doing the treatment’?  By screaming at
them and insulting them?  That might be worth something,
I know I’ve done it in my day.  What I understand us to
be arguing is that that the more together we are on these
questions of social bonding, taking responsibility, and
the like, the stronger position we are in vis-à-vis the
‘parties doing the treatment’.  We hope to WIN the 
argument with the clinical system as it now stands, in
favor of the ‘free spirits’ of the clients.

Cynthia Bage wrote:

>I agree with Stuart, er, I mean Kevin, one hundred percent when he says
>that clients are not the only ones who should be held accountable.  In a
>civilized society, every person who is old enough to think is held
>accountable for what they say and do.  Although it seems our society is
>becoming less and less civilized, this has more to do with the people in
>power not wishing to take responsibility than it does with those who are
>thought of as powerless.

Cynthia, you are arguing based on Kevin’s gross misreading
of our position.  I think you are right, and I think your point
of society becoming ‘less and less civilized’ is very important.
The clients are going to have to help the society become more
civilized, quite as the women’s movement has helped the society
to become more sensitive to the social relations of gender role.
The fundamental thought we have is one of empowerment, that we
are capable of being more effective in dealing with ‘the people
in power not wishing to take responsibility’.

Overall, in my understanding we stand (1) for clients being ‘free
spirits’ and (2) for holding the ‘treatment providers’/system
accountable for their irresponsible actions.  I don't think we
want clients to behave like us, yuk, what an awful thought!

Andrew Phelps